WG: [Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten] Definition and scope of Holding

Fri Apr 26 08:21:01 CEST 2013

I forward your mail to the list...
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Philipp Zumstein [mailto:philipp.zumstein at bib.uni-mannheim.de]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. April 2013 19:07
> An: Klee, Carsten
> Betreff: Re: [Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten] Definition and scope of Holding
> 
> > I also like to add an 'or', which makes the 'inventory information'
> optional (in case someone only describes the access to an item)
> 
> Okay, that was the critical point for PDA or databases, because they are
> not (in a legal sense) in the inventory of the library.
> 
> Best,
> Philipp
> 
> 
> Am 24.04.2013 19:39, schrieb Klee, Carsten:
> > Hi Owen and everyone else!
> >
> > Thank you for your note and the link.
> >
> > I think you are absolutely right. A holding description should not be
> confused with a Collection Level Description.
> >
> > On the website I found this levels listing of the granularity of library
> metadata [1]. And surely we have to deal with level 6 and 7. And that for
> my definition is misleading.
> >
> > Like Jörg earlier said we should consider the 'notion of "units" in an
> item' (see level 7). This is what I was trying to express with "collection
> of items". But I was wrong with what I thought an item actually is.
> >
> > What I had in mind was our holding description of a Periodical. We do
> not describe one "issue" but a bunch of "issues". So I thought: issue =
> item and issues = collection of items. But this is obviously wrong. It's
> more like item = entity. And an item can have zero, one or more units.
> >
> > So I like to change my holding definition. I discard "a collection of
> items" to the favour of an item, which (I learned now) can consist of
> units. I also like to add an 'or', which makes the 'inventory information'
> optional (in case someone only describes the access to an item):
> >
> > "A description of one agents inventory information and/or access
> information for an item."
> >
> > Cheers!
> >
> > Carsten
> >
> > [1]
> <http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Library_standards_and_linked_da
> ta#Granularity_of_library_metadata>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Carsten Klee
> > Abt. Überregionale Bibliographische Dienste IIE
> > Staatsbibliothek zu Berlin - Preußischer Kulturbesitz
> >
> > Fon:  +49 30 266-43 44 02
> >
> >
> >> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> >> Von: dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten-bounces at lists.d-nb.de [mailto:dini-ag-
> kim-
> >> bestandsdaten-bounces at lists.d-nb.de] Im Auftrag von Owen Stephens
> >> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 24. April 2013 11:32
> >> An: dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten at lists.d-nb.de
> >> Betreff: Re: [Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten] Definition and scope of
> Holding
> >>
> >> Two of the definitions proposed on the wiki
> >> (https://wiki.dnb.de/display/DINIAGKIM/Definition+of+Holding) include
> the
> >> concept that a 'holding' can describe not just a single
> resource/document
> >> but a collection or group of resources/documents/items
> >>
> >> "Group of data elements describing one institution's copies of a
> >> bibliographic resource or group of like or similar bibliographic
> >> resources"
> >> Carsten: "A description of one agents inventory and access information
> for
> >> a item or collection of items."
> >>
> >> This makes me wonder about the relation between Holdings and Collection
> >> Level Descriptions. It might be worth looking at Gordon Dunsire's work
> on
> >> CLD Use Case for the W3C LLD incubator
> >>
> >> http://www.w3.org/2005/Incubator/lld/wiki/Use_Case_Collection-
> >> Level_Description
> >>
> >> Owen
> >>
> >>
> >> Owen Stephens
> >> Owen Stephens Consulting
> >> Web: http://www.ostephens.com
> >> Email: owen at ostephens.com
> >> Telephone: 0121 288 6936
> >>
> >> On 24 Apr 2013, at 08:48, Philipp Zumstein <philipp.zumstein at bib.uni-
> >> mannheim.de> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Hi *,
> >>>
> >>> I see three different aspects for "holding":
> >>> 1) general holding information
> >>> 2) service portfolio
> >>> 3) current status
> >>>
> >>> Examples for 1) are call number, location on a shelf, bill number,
> >> acquisition date, corresponding title, and "owner" of an item.
> >>>
> >>> Examples for 2) are: on spot consultation, borrow for 3 weeks with
> >> possible extension, copy/scan service, inter-library loan. Moreover,
> most
> >> of the services are restricted to some persons (e.g. students, faculty,
> >> libraries) and they may also be restricted to a time period (e.g.
> duration
> >> of an exposition, or PDF with DRM).
> >>>
> >>> Examples for 3) are: available/not available, on the loan, stolen, not
> >> on the shelf, loan possible at the moment?.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> It would be nice to model all three aspects. Also it might be a
> >> challenge to give up-to-date information for aspect 3). By the way, I
> >> think with most of the "holding" definition are not perfect. For
> example
> >> with patron driven acquisition (PDA), you are not "holding" the items
> (you
> >> haven't bought the ebooks yet), still you provide a service to your
> users.
> >> Another example is a database, which you are not the owner of, but
> still
> >> you provide a service to your costumer (maybe for a limited time).
> >>>
> >>> Best regards,
> >>> Philipp
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Am 22.04.2013 13:14, schrieb Klee, Carsten:
> >>>> Hi everyone!
> >>>>
> >>>> I would like to keep the discussion ongoing. Maybe we can discuss the
> >> definition and scope of a holding al little bit more.
> >>>>
> >>>> Just a reminder: I created a wiki page [1] about the definition of a
> >> holding. Till now there is still one definition from the ISO 20775,
> which
> >> is very a library definition.
> >>>>
> >>>> I would like to suggest another one, hoping this one is more
> abstract:
> >>>>
> >>>> Holding: A description of one agents inventory and access information
> >> for a item or collection of items.
> >>>>
> >>>> I chose 'agent' because of foaf:Agent [2], which subsumes
> Organisation,
> >> Group and Person. With 'inventory' I'm not sure, but the word 'holding'
> in
> >> a definition of 'holding' seems to be bad. Then I chose 'item' not
> >> 'document'. Item relates to frbr:Item [3] but I'm not totally sure
> about
> >> this.
> >>>>
> >>>> Now about the scope of holding. Owen Stephens asked earlier if we're
> >> going "[...] represent solely the ownership of things by a library (or
> >> other organisation/person) or some other aspects (such as their current
> >> location which could include 'on loan to person X')".
> >>>>
> >>>> I would like to suggest that we stick with the idea of micro-
> >> ontologies. Meaning: If possible and applicable move every complex
> aspect
> >> to another ontology. And I think the information 'on loan to person X'
> is
> >> such an aspect. But this is just my thought about this. As I said,
> maybe
> >> we can come to a discussion about it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Cheers!
> >>>>
> >>>> Carsten
> >>>>
> >>>> [1] <https://wiki.dnb.de/display/DINIAGKIM/Definition+of+Holding>
> >>>> [2] <http://xmlns.com/foaf/spec/#term_Agent>
> >>>> [3] <http://vocab.org/frbr/core.html#Item>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Carsten Klee
> >>>> Abt. Überregionale Bibliographische Dienste IIE
> >>>> Staatsbibliothek zu Berlin - Preußischer Kulturbesitz
> >>>> Potsdamer Straße 33
> >>>> 10785 Berlin
> >>>>
> >>>> Fon:  +49 30 266-43 44 02
> >>>> Fax:   +49 30 266-33 40 01
> >>>> carsten.klee at sbb.spk-berlin.de
> >>>> www.zeitschriftendatenbank.de
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten mailing list
> >>>> Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten at lists.d-nb.de
> >>>> http://lists.d-nb.de/mailman/listinfo/dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Dr. Philipp Zumstein
> >>> Universitätsbibliothek Mannheim
> >>> Fachreferat Mathematik und Informatik
> >>> Schloss Schneckenhof West / 68131 Mannheim
> >>> Tel. 0621/181-3067 bzw. 3006
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten mailing list
> >>> Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten at lists.d-nb.de
> >>> http://lists.d-nb.de/mailman/listinfo/dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
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> >> Dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten at lists.d-nb.de
> >> http://lists.d-nb.de/mailman/listinfo/dini-ag-kim-bestandsdaten
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> >
> 
> 
> --
> Dr. Philipp Zumstein
> Universitätsbibliothek Mannheim
> Fachreferat Mathematik und Informatik
> Schloss Schneckenhof West / 68131 Mannheim
> Tel. 0621/181-3067 bzw. 3006